Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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Capt. Sir Dominic Flandry » Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:25 pm
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http://www.metro.co.uk/film/834965-casi ... club[quote][/quote]
Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

The name’s McD. Ross McD. Oh, and Ross McG is here as well. Let the guys behind movie argument website http://www.rossvross.com take you through a Bond battle to decide which 007 does it better. Do you expect us to talk?

Casino Royale takes on GoldenEye in this week's Metro Film Fight Club Casino Royale takes on GoldenEye in this week's Metro Film Fight Club

Ross McD: Casino Royale

‘Now the whole world is going to know you died scratching my balls.’

When Casino Royale hit the big screen in 2006, we were crying out for some realistic 007 after so much campness. So. Much. Campness. How much campness? Twenty films full, that’s how much. How the Bond franchise survived that long without reinvention, I’ll never know. Bond, James Bond, foils (insert megalomaniac name here) while driving (insert car here), uses (insert gadget here), stops to shag (insert sexist name pun here), makes quip, wins. The end.

Twenty times we paid into the cinema to see that. Granted, GoldenEye was one of, if not the best of the old batch. But just like the old batch, it was stale, covered in mould and in serious need of some fresh dough.

Let’s start at the start. GoldenEye’s opening scene – the dam bungee jump – while impressive, was clearly set at the dam just so he could show off by doing the d**n bungee jump. And who hasn’t done a bungee jump anyway? The freerunning/parkour chase at the start of Casino is exhilarating and fresh, something we had never really seen before.

Despite having a body that would justify it, Craig doesn’t once pull a stupid smug grin and wait for some honey to mount him: Casino for once casts a woman who actually matters to the plot. We pity Craig’s young Bond for falling for Eva Green’s wiles, but wouldn’t you have just loved to see the smarmy grin wiped off Connery’s, Moore’s or even Brosnan’s face after realising they’d been had by a lowly sex-mannequin? I mean, woman? While Vesper might still sound like something you’d like to ride, it is a little more subtle than Onatopp.

Casino Royale’ s poker scenes are edited superbly, keeping hold’em veterans and noobs equally engrossed. And although the final set of hands were as likely as an invisible Aston Martin, it made for a great watch. Equally great, but so much harder to watch, was probably cinema’s most creative torture scene: whod’ve thought a chair and a bit of rope could be so effective?

And just like Le Chiffre cutting out the seat of that chair, director Martin Campbell knew what to get rid of to leave himself with just the jewels: Q – out. Moneypenny – Out. Cringe-worthy kiss-off lines – out.

Besides the greatest first person shooter of its generation (on the N64), GoldenEye holds just one trump over Casino Royale. It’s not lace or leather, and it sure beat the crap out of that Chris Cornell rubbish. But even Tina Turner would have to admit this sequel theme tune was simply the best:



Ross McG: GoldenEye

‘One rises to meet a challenge…’

Most Bond movies are crap. Their vile combination of shameless marketing, ruthless copying of current trends and lame dialogue do not always make for a pleasant movie-going experience. But among the muck there are a few gems – The Spy Who Loved Me, for instance, is not merely a good Bond film, it’s simply a good film. The same can be said for GoldenEye and Casino Royale. Both were directed by Martin Campbell and both were first outings for new 007s. But one is a streamlined thrill-ride that condenses the best of Bond and forgets the rest. The other, sadly, is Casino Royale.

GoldenEye is a stunningly good action film, from its jaw-dropping opening bungee jump to its implausibly fun tank pursuit. There is always an exciting sequence around the next corner. They would count for little, however, were it not for the new Bond himself, Pierce Brosnan.

While not the greatest of actors, the Irishman embodied Bond in the same way Sean Connery did years earlier – there is not one moment where he looks uncomfortable in the role. The freshness he gives to 007 here just makes it all the more depressing that he was later forced into grimacing his way through a derisory cocktail of invisible cars, shockingly bad innuendos and Madonna.

Conversely, Daniel Craig – who is a good actor – cannot replicate the ease with which his predecessor slipped into the part. While a brooding presence in Casino Royale, he is let down by the film’s desire to turn him into a charmless killer, tacked-on love story excepted. While the first hour in particular is stirring, Craig is largely reduced to playing a Bourne/Bond hybrid – BoBo we can call him – who shoots first and doesn’t ask any questions later. Because he’s too busy punching someone in the face.

Although wisely ditching the lame gags of Dire Another Day – this is no Royale with cheese – BoBo soon runs out of room to beat people up in. So instead of watching him kick people in the groin, we watch him play poker. And then we watch him play more poker. He takes a break to punch and kick some people and then he plays more poker. Watching people play poker is boring, almost as boring as watching Quantum Of Solace.

In GoldenEye, Bond doesn’t have time to sit down and play cards – he’s too busy blowing things up and saving the day. He also has some decent baddies to kill. The voluptuous but deadly Xenia Onatopp is arguably the best Bond girl ever, while BoBo must take down a guy who’s good at adding up numbers and can’t stop crying. Couldn’t he just get a primary school bully to sort him out?

Casino Royale is a good film – to say otherwise is ridiculous – but GoldenEye has a better Bond, better baddies, better action and a better theme tune. In fact, no Bond does it better…

br>
WHICH IS THE BETTER BOND? TELL US IN THE COMMENTS SECTION BELOW…

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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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FormerBondFan » Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:10 am
GoldenEye. Hands down!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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hunderpussy » Wed Apr 06, 2011 9:10 am
Goldeneye, :cheers:
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by shaken not stirred »

shaken not stirred » Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:21 am
Goldeneye, I'd rather staple My nuts to the wall than vote for crappino borale.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Blowfeld »

Blowfeld » Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:36 pm
I would disagree about the stunts; GE's stunt seems tame after 16 years but it was and still is spectacular. The parkour was everywhere before CR, Top Gear had a better parkour chase, NCIS New York as well.

It seems to allow for the failings of CR the reviewer has to basically not be a fan of the 20 previous entries. Mouldy indeed!
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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FormerBondFan » Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:56 pm
Most of the original Bonds aren't campy even some of Rog's films..
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Omega »

Omega » Wed Apr 06, 2011 7:35 pm
GoldenEye no question, aside from the first 10 minutes CR drags.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Dr. No »

Dr. No » Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:26 pm
In the picture used only one of them like like Bond. I didn't get int o the review so i skimmed it, I would agree that Pierce look at ease being Bond Craig is not at ease in his own skin so is not at ease trying to pretend to be a spy whos name happens to be Bond. I do think Pierce and Sean had very strong presence on screen and easily met audence expectations.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by James »

James » Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:27 pm
GoldenEye is a lot more fun but I do think Campbell is probably the most overrated Bond director.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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James wrote:James » Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:27 pm
GoldenEye is a lot more fun but I do think Campbell is probably the most overrated Bond director.
Yes, thank you. Can I push my luck? Agree with me that John Glen is the most underrated, and overly (and unnecessarily) maligned?
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by James »

James » Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:47 pm
I agree! The John Glen films frequently looked lavish. I like GE but it does look like a television film in places. I don't know why the films since 1995 have seemed smaller and less grand than the Cubby series.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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James wrote:James » Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:47 pm
I like GE but it does look like a television film in places.
How dare you say that to GE? :( If there's one example of a movie that looks like a TV film in places, that's Star Trek: Insurrection. GE has a cinematic feel and is a true definition of modern Bond film.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by James »

James » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:11 pm
The ending was big. That was the last really good ending to a Bond film I think.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Irony-man »

Irony-man » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:58 pm
I just watched GoldenEye again the other night and I mean I actually watched it, I didn't just have it on in the background while I worked or surfed the net. I had forgotten how serious a film it actually is. Yes there are some instances of humour but for the most part the tone is almost melancholy. I have also been rereading the original Fleming novels - gotten as a set for a steal in the bargain books section of my local bookstore - and it struck that GoldenEye actually matches the tone of Fleming's novel almost better than any other Bond film There was always a streak of melancholy running thru Fleming, which went far to explain Bond's character. In the books Bond knows he only has a few more missions left (i guess he didn't realize that he would be Roger Moore later in his career :wink: ) and his excesses were there to help him maximize his enjoyment of life, which he knew would soon have to end, either thru death or retirement. GoldenEye matches that tone from a different source with Bond feeling out of place in the new world and wondering if his usefulness was finally over. It leads splendidly to the final fight with 006 - a fight which is almost the equal of the FRWL train fight - where you can almost feel Bond taking out his angst on Alec, as if he knew that his displacement started with Alec's betrayal of him and the country he had always believed in.

Overall a tremendously satisfying film.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Omega »

Irony-man wrote:Irony-man » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:58 pm
I just watched GoldenEye again the other night and I mean I actually watched it, I didn't just have it on in the background while I worked or surfed the net. I had forgotten how serious a film it actually is. Yes there are some instances of humour but for the most part the tone is almost melancholy. I have also been rereading the original Fleming novels - gotten as a set for a steal in the bargain books section of my local bookstore - and it struck that GoldenEye actually matches the tone of Fleming's novel almost better than any other Bond film There was always a streak of melancholy running thru Fleming, which went far to explain Bond's character. In the books Bond knows he only has a few more missions left (i guess he didn't realize that he would be Roger Moore later in his career :wink: ) and his excesses were there to help him maximize his enjoyment of life, which he knew would soon have to end, either thru death or retirement. GoldenEye matches that tone from a different source with Bond feeling out of place in the new world and wondering if his usefulness was finally over. It leads splendidly to the final fight with 006 - a fight which is almost the equal of the FRWL train fight - where you can almost feel Bond taking out his angst on Alec, as if he knew that his displacement started with Alec's betrayal of him and the country he had always believed in.

Overall a tremendously satisfying film.
I didn't know that. DAD had a similar tone except the last hour seemed to belong to another movie.

Everyone say Her Majesty's Secrete Service is the best adaption of Fleming novel I never thought about this take on the Bond character. In this way Sean Connery's and Brosnan's take on Bond seem more in line with Fleming.

CR will not last as well as GE, CR is already dated and if you take time to think about the plot and motivations starts to not make sense. Craig is a bad example of a "young man" and a newly minted agent. A officer in the service and an experienced operator in the special forces as Bond is suppsoed to be would never make any of the mistakes he made, or not know how to dress up as Craig was suppsoed to be a virgin to a suit and tie or cummerbund. Trust me the most raw recruit crawling through the mud and being shot at knows how to look good when the occasion call for it. That is why I say Craig looks like guy who is a retired mailman trying out killing as second career. Nothing else explains it.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by shaken not stirred »

shaken not stirred » Sat Apr 09, 2011 10:45 pm

Omega wrote:
Irony-man wrote:Craig is a bad example of a "young man"
Cregg looks like an old man :lol: , hell if brenden frasier does another mummy film cregg could be the mummy, hell he could've been the sandman in spiderman 3, he could use his dry acting as bond in that role since the role calls for someone dry (ie turns into sand).

Welcome to the forums irony-man and awesome name man, the ironman films are more inline with what bond should still be today, eon needs to drop the bully shrek bond and go back to the guy who knew he's james bond.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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shaken not stirred wrote: Welcome to the forums irony-man and awesome name man, the ironman films are more inline with what bond should still be today, eon needs to drop the bully shrek bond and go back to the guy who knew he's james bond.
GoldenEye Wii is NOT a James Bond game along with any other Bond games starring DC.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

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FormerBondFan wrote: GoldenEye Wii is NOT a James Bond game along with any other Bond games starring DC.

Never played the wii goldeneye, knew who was in it and that was enough for Me, if I want to play as kratos (sorry craigs bond) I'll play god of war.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by Thunderpussy »

Thunderpussy » Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:49 am
I find it hard enough to watch Craig on screen let alone, spend more of my money to get him on my Computer.
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Re: Casino Royale v GoldenEye: Metro Film Fight Club

Post by floranicolas »

I like Goldeneye because Derek Meddings was still involved. I think the Bond series has lost too many of the old faces now and doesn't feel the same anymore.GoldenEye was one of, if not the best of the old batch. But just like the old batch, it was stale, covered in mould and in serious need of some fresh dough.
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