Thunderball vs YOLT

General Bond discussion from Sean Connery to Pierce Brosnan
User avatar
ml94
Single O
Posts: 830
Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:32 am
Favorite Bond Movie: GOLDFINGER, FOR YOUR EYES ONLY, THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS, GOLDENEYE.
Favorite Movies: T2 & THE DARK KNIGHT.

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by ml94 »

Veronica wrote:And I have to say this,God forgive me,but I was never that impressed with Goldfinger. I can see why people call it the best. It introduced many aspects we've come to instantly inspect in a Bond movie...so many iconic scenes as well. I mean who doesn't know about the golden painted girl?The laser scene.. but the one thing that always confused me is why Goldfinger wants to radiate the gold in Fort Knox? First he tells how he admired gold all his life to its color etc... but his plan is to actually radiate the other gold so he could sell his. If he loves gold so much why sell it? He's already richer than God...
For me, Goldfinger is one of the best...yeah that sound little stupid.
Veronica
Agent
Posts: 1804
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:08 pm
Favorite Bond Movie: From Russia With Love,GoldenEye,The Spy Who Loved Me,Goldfinger,Dr.No
Favorite Movies: After the Sunset,The Devil Wears Prada,The Thomas Crown Affair,To Catch a Thief,Midnight in Paris,North by Northwest, Purple Noon, La piscine.

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Veronica »

ml94 wrote:
Veronica wrote:And I have to say this,God forgive me,but I was never that impressed with Goldfinger. I can see why people call it the best. It introduced many aspects we've come to instantly inspect in a Bond movie...so many iconic scenes as well. I mean who doesn't know about the golden painted girl?The laser scene.. but the one thing that always confused me is why Goldfinger wants to radiate the gold in Fort Knox? First he tells how he admired gold all his life to its color etc... but his plan is to actually radiate the other gold so he could sell his. If he loves gold so much why sell it? He's already richer than God...
For me, Goldfinger is one of the best...yeah that sound little stupid.
Well of course Goldfinger is one of the best Bond movies easily belongs into the top 4 Bond movies. Iconic scenes,the car the martini and everything and Goldfinger's plot is incredibly smart. It's just a little confusing after his talk about gold before.
User avatar
Count_Lippe
Agent
Posts: 755
Joined: Fri May 04, 2007 2:15 am

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Count_Lippe »

The plot in Fleming's book was a little stupid actually, there the idea was for Goldfinger to rob Fort Knox and take the gold with him.

The filmmakers realized this would sound very impractical so they came up with the idea to make the gold in Fort Knox radioactive instead.

The intention is to make Goldfinger's gold worth a lot more, not for him to sell his own gold.
Image
User avatar
ml94
Single O
Posts: 830
Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:32 am
Favorite Bond Movie: GOLDFINGER, FOR YOUR EYES ONLY, THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS, GOLDENEYE.
Favorite Movies: T2 & THE DARK KNIGHT.

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by ml94 »

Veronica wrote:
ml94 wrote:
Veronica wrote:And I have to say this,God forgive me,but I was never that impressed with Goldfinger. I can see why people call it the best. It introduced many aspects we've come to instantly inspect in a Bond movie...so many iconic scenes as well. I mean who doesn't know about the golden painted girl?The laser scene.. but the one thing that always confused me is why Goldfinger wants to radiate the gold in Fort Knox? First he tells how he admired gold all his life to its color etc... but his plan is to actually radiate the other gold so he could sell his. If he loves gold so much why sell it? He's already richer than God...
For me, Goldfinger is one of the best...yeah that sound little stupid.
Well of course Goldfinger is one of the best Bond movies easily belongs into the top 4 Bond movies. Iconic scenes,the car the martini and everything and Goldfinger's plot is incredibly smart. It's just a little confusing after his talk about gold before.
Yeah, you are right.
User avatar
Kristatos
OO Moderator
OO Moderator
Posts: 12526
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:26 pm
Location: St. Cyril's

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Kristatos »

Veronica wrote:And I have to say this,God forgive me,but I was never that impressed with Goldfinger. I can see why people call it the best. It introduced many aspects we've come to instantly inspect in a Bond movie...so many iconic scenes as well. I mean who doesn't know about the golden painted girl?The laser scene.. but the one thing that always confused me is why Goldfinger wants to radiate the gold in Fort Knox? First he tells how he admired gold all his life to its color etc... but his plan is to actually radiate the other gold so he could sell his. If he loves gold so much why sell it? He's already richer than God...
It makes more sense than the plot of the book, in which he planned to steal the gold. It was changed when someone pointed out that it would take years to haul that amount of gold out of Fort Knox. Though you're right that it creates a character anomaly. But then, who ever expects a Bond villain's plan to make perfect logical sense?
"He's the one that doesn't smile" - Queen Elizabeth II on Daniel Craig
Veronica
Agent
Posts: 1804
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:08 pm
Favorite Bond Movie: From Russia With Love,GoldenEye,The Spy Who Loved Me,Goldfinger,Dr.No
Favorite Movies: After the Sunset,The Devil Wears Prada,The Thomas Crown Affair,To Catch a Thief,Midnight in Paris,North by Northwest, Purple Noon, La piscine.

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Veronica »

Count_Lippe wrote:The plot in Fleming's book was a little stupid actually, there the idea was for Goldfinger to rob Fort Knox and take the gold with him.

The filmmakers realized this would sound very impractical so they came up with the idea to make the gold in Fort Knox radioactive instead.

The intention is to make Goldfinger's gold worth a lot more, not for him to sell his own gold.

But if he doesn't want to sell it then what would be the worth of his gold then?
User avatar
Count_Lippe
Agent
Posts: 755
Joined: Fri May 04, 2007 2:15 am

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Count_Lippe »

He will be richer because the gold he has will be worth more. Have you never heard of people investing in antiques or whatever, and sometimes the price goes up or down for these things.

It's a better plot than the book version in any case as we've explained.
Image
Veronica
Agent
Posts: 1804
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:08 pm
Favorite Bond Movie: From Russia With Love,GoldenEye,The Spy Who Loved Me,Goldfinger,Dr.No
Favorite Movies: After the Sunset,The Devil Wears Prada,The Thomas Crown Affair,To Catch a Thief,Midnight in Paris,North by Northwest, Purple Noon, La piscine.

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Veronica »

Count_Lippe wrote:He will be richer because the gold he has will be worth more. Have you never heard of people investing in antiques or whatever, and sometimes the price goes up or down for these things.

It's a better plot than the book version in any case as we've explained.
Well...that makes sense. I've heard people call Goldfinger the worst book Fleming wrote and how the plot was stupid.
Odessy
New Recruit
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:46 pm

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Odessy »

If you read a bit of WW2 history you will notice that there are elements of Goldfinger which resemble the laundering of Nazi looted Gold from Germany through Switzerland, via Lisbon by overland truck convoys to Wall street which occurred from 1941-1943 in defiance of the British Naval blockade.

I tend to suspect Fleming wanted to tell the WW2 story, but was too close to the bone and had to re-write most of the story to conceal the truth of WW2. activities.

Germany was buying tungsten from Union Carbide via Lisbon during the war with gold looted from Czechoslovakia, France, Belgium, Netherlands, Greece etc and American interests were happy to launder the gold.
User avatar
Kristatos
OO Moderator
OO Moderator
Posts: 12526
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:26 pm
Location: St. Cyril's

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Kristatos »

Odessy wrote:
I tend to suspect Fleming wanted to tell the WW2 story, but was too close to the bone and had to re-write most of the story to conceal the truth of WW2. activities.
Interesting. Was that information classified, even after WW2? I suspect it was more the case that he was inspired by the story, but changed the details to make it fit Bond's world better. But then, I'm a writer, and tend to look at things from the perspective of storytelling technique.
"He's the one that doesn't smile" - Queen Elizabeth II on Daniel Craig
Odessy
New Recruit
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:46 pm

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by Odessy »

Kristatos wrote:
Odessy wrote:
I tend to suspect Fleming wanted to tell the WW2 story, but was too close to the bone and had to re-write most of the story to conceal the truth of WW2. activities.
Interesting. Was that information classified, even after WW2? I suspect it was more the case that he was inspired by the story, but changed the details to make it fit Bond's world better. But then, I'm a writer, and tend to look at things from the perspective of storytelling technique.
General Electric who owned Tungsten Carbide was quietly prosecuted after the war for trading with the enemy. US executives were lightly slapped with a mild prosecution whilst their German counterparts in the same deals were tried at Nuremberg.

Tungsten Carbide deals with Nazis in WW2
User avatar
commander0077again
Commander
Posts: 337
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 5:56 am
Favorite Bond Movie: OHMSS YOLT GOLDFINGER LALD FYEO GOLDENEYE
Favorite Movies: OUR MAN FLINT THE ADVENTURES OF ROBIN HOOD/ERROL FLYNN CASABLANCA ZORRO FILMS / TV SHOW
Location: Hong Kong by the Sea

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by commander0077again »

Barry Niven wrote:Difficult to say. The cons of TB is that it moves too slowly and takes forever to get to where it's going, and I can't stand that drippy Domino whose BIG Moment of spearing Largo in the back is somehow meant to *atone* for her overall useless, clueless, helpless, accident-prone idiocy (it doesn't). But the pros are MVP John Barry's impressive music that actually makes the underwater slow-motion bearable, the pre-credits sequence with the jetpack that really doesn't make any sense but is always SuperCOOL to witness, and Lucianna Paluzzi the Foxy Red-Haired Italian MILF* as Fiona Volpe. Rowwwlllll.

That said, YOLT has the edge because it moves faster overall, has Ken Adams' fearsome Volcano Set, Donald Pleasence's hysterically creepy Blofeld, an even better Barry score, and NINJAS! But... slows down badly with the Fake Wedding scene, the busty German Helga Brandt being a dull carbon copy of Fiona (plus, Karin Dor's not an actual redhead), and Connery looking lame in his Japanese Fisherman disguise. Still both movies are better than Diamonds Are Forever, and that's a good thing. Amirite?

* - Really, she was. I checked on IMDB. How awesome was that?
Agree with much on TB... the pros are the over-the-top conference room, with one of the Double O's with his palm supporting his face; SPECTRE being its usually mysterious self. A great villain in Largo ... his eye patch, his voice (dubbed and funny, just like Tiger Tanaka's ... why, they sound like the same person!" ... this is what Bond villains are supposed to be like, sneering and supercilious. Like Alan Rickman (btw, have you seen him in Harry Potter? a laff a second). Great Bond lines, "It t'isn't, 'tis it?"
YOLT ... I have to disagree on the wedding .... when we first see Kissy, Barry's music elevates it to a Bond Moment, an iconic shot ... the other is 'Mountains and Sunsets' ... I have always played that in my head when seeing a spectacular vista, such as Hong Kong or a certain, er, beautiful girl..... I love Osato's office, too. Would Ken Adam be hired nowadays by Eon? They had an incredible team; can you imagine Connery without John Barry? Without the sets, the music, the direction, Bond could easily have failed. I see YOLT as Bond as samurai, as a Musashi, unflappable because of his incredible focus ... and that allows him to transcend what would kill an ordinary man. Oops, sorry for getting too serious! YOLT overflows with classic scenes ... a favorite is Bond's "Think you can make it?" this to a super fit Ama girl, and this is a chubby Bond who smokes 60 cigarettes a day! Tiger is the best buddy, he actually has fun and not just Bond's foil. Don't forget his cool dubbed voice and energetic acting. :cake:
You move very well for a dead man, Mister Bond

Kill him!
Kill Bond! Now!!!
User avatar
commander0077again
Commander
Posts: 337
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 5:56 am
Favorite Bond Movie: OHMSS YOLT GOLDFINGER LALD FYEO GOLDENEYE
Favorite Movies: OUR MAN FLINT THE ADVENTURES OF ROBIN HOOD/ERROL FLYNN CASABLANCA ZORRO FILMS / TV SHOW
Location: Hong Kong by the Sea

Re: Thunderball vs YOLT

Post by commander0077again »

Odessy wrote:
Kristatos wrote:
Odessy wrote:
I tend to suspect Fleming wanted to tell the WW2 story, but was too close to the bone and had to re-write most of the story to conceal the truth of WW2. activities.
Interesting. Was that information classified, even after WW2? I suspect it was more the case that he was inspired by the story, but changed the details to make it fit Bond's world better. But then, I'm a writer, and tend to look at things from the perspective of storytelling technique.
General Electric who owned Tungsten Carbide was quietly prosecuted after the war for trading with the enemy. US executives were lightly slapped with a mild prosecution whilst their German counterparts in the same deals were tried at Nuremberg.

Tungsten Carbide deals with Nazis in WW2
Should mention an open secret 'everyone' knows: the Rockefellers were business partners with IG Farben, who manufactured poison gases used in the concentration camps; they also ran the camps as business enterprises. After the war, IGF executives just got the usual slaps on the wrists. Their plants were never bombed during the war. US and Germany had a long association during and after the war from export of their scientists and even 'likely' war criminals. A tangent of this is another open secret where Hitler escaped to Argentina, where Juan Peron and Evita shared in the Nazi loot. In Argentina this is not even an open secret, it's out in the open. The director of the FBI, Hoover, Stalin and Eisenhower have all on record 'hinted' very strongly that Hitler was alive.
You move very well for a dead man, Mister Bond

Kill him!
Kill Bond! Now!!!
Post Reply