So what's your problem?

Captain Nash · Post by **Captain Nash** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 12:46 pm

As many of you may well be aware I have no hatred for Daniel Craig and think his Bond is a good one.
Now I've read many of the posts on here that diss him and find the height, hair colour and apparent uglyness to be trivial points to dislike the man.
So what are your real problems with the casting of Daniel Craig as James Bond?

Post by **James** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 2:30 pm

I've put up a review which states why I don't think Craig is a great fit for James Bond and others have done the same. I think the films should change but Bond should remain Bond. No matter how hard I tried I couldn't really accept that Craig was James Bond.

Post by **Kristatos** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:17 pm

My problem is that EON have effectively said that from now on, all Bond films are going to be like CR. I've no objection in principle to a darker, grittier, more Flemingesque Bond. I liked OHMSS, FYEO and LTK. But at no time during the release of those films were we told that we would never again see the parts of the Bond films that Cubby added to the mix - the gadgets, the over-the-top villains, the stylised production design.

Here's an analogy I thought of this morning. Remember when Coca-Cola dropped Classic Coke in favour of New Coke? The outcry was such that they were forced to bring back Classic Coke as well as New Coke. But imagine that New Coke had been more popular than Classic Coke, so that Classic Coke was retired permanently. Now imagine that you like both Classic Coke and New Coke. Do you see where I'm going with this?

Captain Nash · Post by **Captain Nash** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:26 pm

Yeah, you like coke!

And at no time have Eon said that any of the elements you've listed would be gone forever. This isn't the drastic change that many think it is. Imagine YOLT then seeing OHMSS as the next Bond film. It's a similar situation in some ways. Though the chance of Brosnan returning is not going to happen, as CR was a massive hit at the box office. As a Bond fan I'm happy with Craig, but even more happy that there is still a general audience of Bond films to keep the series alive. There's nothing that can be done about DC, so why bother. But so long as there's an audience that embrace this character we should all be happy.

Post by **Kristatos** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:29 pm

Captain Nash wrote:Yeah you like coke!

Actually, I don't. It's just a metaphor.

Captain Nash · Post by **Captain Nash** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:44 pm

Kristatos wrote:
Captain Nash wrote:Yeah you like coke!
Actually, I don't. It's just a metaphor.

So you're a Pepsi man then!

paco chaos · Post by **paco chaos** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:45 pm

to be fair to Craig, besides my obvious dislike of his look as Bond, he doesn't really generate any of the charisma I associate with James Bond. I don't mind a darker style, since I too find OHMSS, and LTK to be some of the stronger entries. I might warm up to him in the next installment, if they were to put him opposite a better female lead. I did find Eva Green to be the biggest liablility in Casino Royale. So maybe Craig might come off a bit more charming if he himself could play against a charming woman, instead of an awkward type.

Post by **Kristatos** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 8:31 pm

Captain Nash wrote:
Kristatos wrote:
Captain Nash wrote:Yeah you like coke!
Actually, I don't. It's just a metaphor.
So you're a Pepsi man then!

Not really a cola drinker - I prefer Dr. Pepper.

Captain Nash · Post by **Captain Nash** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 3:42 am

Kristatos wrote:
Captain Nash wrote:
Kristatos wrote:
Captain Nash wrote:Yeah you like coke!
Actually, I don't. It's just a metaphor.
So you're a Pepsi man then!

Not really a cola drinker - I prefer Dr. Pepper.

Ahhh so you're Forrest Gump then!

stockslivevan · Post by **stockslivevan** » Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:01 am

Prefer the Cherry Coke/Pepsi myself.

Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:39 pm

Daniel Craig is 5'11; has a blonde crewcut; has embraked on a bodybuilding routine; is 38 and looks a bit older; he's not very good with comedy; he has interpreted Bond as a socially retarted psychopath; he's too old to be a "young Bond on his early mission who becomes bond etc etc etc

Post by **Skywalker** » Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:55 pm

Capt. Sir Dominic Flandry wrote:Daniel Craig is 5'11; has a blonde crewcut; has embraked on a bodybuilding routine; is 38 and looks a bit older; he's not very good with comedy; he has interpreted Bond as a socially retarted psychopath; he's too old to be a "young Bond on his early mission who becomes bond etc etc etc

I disagree Dom.

He looks a lot older than 38.

Captain Nash · Post by **Captain Nash** » Wed May 02, 2007 1:34 am

Capt. Sir Dominic Flandry wrote:Daniel Craig is 5'11; has a blonde crewcut; has embraked on a bodybuilding routine; is 38 and looks a bit older; he's not very good with comedy; he has interpreted Bond as a socially retarted psychopath; he's too old to be a "young Bond on his early mission who becomes bond etc etc etc

What's a retart Dom?
I'm thinking maybe Lindsay Lohan after she cleans herself up, but then quickly goes back to her old ways.

Jermaine76 · Post by **Jermaine76** » Fri May 25, 2007 4:41 am

I don't hate the guy myself. You can't blame him for taking the role because of the money and popularity. I would take the role myself, even if I wasn't Bond material. Intially, the issues I had with him were his looks. I've never seen him in other movies so I didn't know if he could act or not. I was willing to give the guy a chance anyway. I saw the trailer that was available about this time last year. That pose at the end of the trailer wasn't good, but I still felt that I had to give the man a chance because I'm a Bond fan and I can't turn my back on him. So I saw the midnight showing and left pissed. To me, his acting as James Bond isn't good at all. His demeanor on screen wasn't good...actually it wasn't there. He's not the type of Bond that can walk into a crowded room and people would notice. When I was watching him on the big screen, he did not assure me that he is James Bond. I did not have the same confidence in him that I had in Dalton and Brosnan. When Brosnan said "The name's Bond.....James Bond" to Xenia Onatopp in GE, I was relieved. I predicted Brosnan would be 007 back in 1984 and it came true, but I was skeptical about him until that moment. To me, the person playing Bond has to have the skill to be able to walk up to any women and get in with it. No matter if the girl is black, white, asian or whatever. Craig, IMO, can't pull this off. So they get a decent looking actress in Eva Green to be his opposite. If you really think about it.. the other girl who played Solance wasn't all that either. I see better looking girls that come in my restaurant everyday. Granted, I would hit both of them off in a heartbeat, but thats beside the point.

Not only his demeanor and the way he carries himself on screen, but the other things he did in the movie that annoyed the hell out of me. Its getting late for me so I'll just use one example. He loses in the card game and then gets mad beause Vespar wouldn't give him any more money. Instead of thinking about another way to get some more funds, he grabs a steak knife off a waiter's tray and charges towards the villian. First of all, why get pissed over some lost money thats not yours and second, why are you going after the villian with a steak knife in a casino filled with people? Thats just one example I have now. There are more.

Post by **The Sweeney** » Fri May 25, 2007 6:49 am

Jermaine76 wrote:I don't hate the guy myself. You can't blame him for taking the role because of the money and popularity. I would take the role myself, even if I wasn't Bond material. Intially, the issues I had with him were his looks. I've never seen him in other movies so I didn't know if he could act or not. I was willing to give the guy a chance anyway. I saw the trailer that was available about this time last year. That pose at the end of the trailer wasn't good, but I still felt that I had to give the man a chance because I'm a Bond fan and I can't turn my back on him. So I saw the midnight showing and left pissed. To me, his acting as James Bond isn't good at all. His demeanor on screen wasn't good...actually it wasn't there. He's not the type of Bond that can walk into a crowded room and people would notice. When I was watching him on the big screen, he did not assure me that he is James Bond. I did not have the same confidence in him that I had in Dalton and Brosnan. When Brosnan said "The name's Bond.....James Bond" to Xenia Onatopp in GE, I was relieved. I predicted Brosnan would be 007 back in 1984 and it came true, but I was skeptical about him until that moment. To me, the person playing Bond has to have the skill to be able to walk up to any women and get in with it. No matter if the girl is black, white, asian or whatever. Craig, IMO, can't pull this off. So they get a decent looking actress in Eva Green to be his opposite. If you really think about it.. the other girl who played Solance wasn't all that either. I see better looking girls that come in my restaurant everyday. Granted, I would hit both of them off in a heartbeat, but thats beside the point. Not only his demeanor and the way he carries himself on screen, but the other things he did in the movie that annoyed the hell out of me. Its getting late for me so I'll just use one example. He loses in the card game and then gets mad beause Vespar wouldn't give him any more money. Instead of thinking about another way to get some more funds, he grabs a steak knife off a waiter's tray and charges towards the villian. First of all, why get pissed over some lost money thats not yours and second, why are you going after the villian with a steak knife in a casino filled with people? Thats just one example I have now. There are more.

Welcome Jermaine76.

I noticed you have stated that pro Craiger's come out with the usual 4 or 5 points as to why they like him, and the very same can be said of the anti Craigers too. He looks like Gollum, he has blonde hair, he's ugly, he isn't sophisticated enough, etc.

Regarding the steak knife scene, this was to show Bond losing it and suddenly wanting to go and take the guy out. This happened often in the novels. In the book CR, he was very upset when he lost in the card game too, even though it wasn't his money.

One thing I've also noticed with your posts is you are quick to diss anyone claiming Craig is Fleming's Bond. I take it you have read the Fleming books then?

Jermaine76 · Post by **Jermaine76** » Sat May 26, 2007 2:25 am

The Sweeney wrote: Welcome Jermaine76.

I noticed you have stated that pro Craiger's come out with the usual 4 or 5 points as to why they like him, and the very same can be said of the anti Craigers too. He looks like Gollum, he has blonde hair, he's ugly, he isn't sophisticated enough, etc.

We only speak the truth. Unless you can direct me to a place where pro-Craiggers has stated specifics on why they believe Craig is Fleming's Bond, I'll stand by my statement.

The Sweeney wrote: Regarding the steak knife scene, this was to show Bond losing it and suddenly wanting to go and take the guy out. This happened often in the novels. In the book CR, he was very upset when he lost in the card game too, even though it wasn't his money.

One thing I've also noticed with your posts is you are quick to diss anyone claiming Craig is Fleming's Bond. I take it you have read the Fleming books then?

I will admit that I have spoken prematurely. The only two Fleming novels I've read are Casino Royale and Live and Let Die. So maybe I don't qualify to have an opinion. I do talk to a few people that I know personally that have read every Bond novel. I talked to an old manager of mine the other day about Craig and he believes Craig did a decent job in the film. He also believes that Craig isn't Fleming's Bond because, in his opinion, Fleming's Bond wouldn't have lost his cool in the casino after losing the card game.

Post by **carl stromberg** » Sat May 26, 2007 12:21 pm

I think some people argue that Craig's Bond is closer to the essence of Fleming because of his more restrained performance and because of the tone of the film. That's OK, but to suggest that Craig is the cinematic incarnation of Fleming's Bond is going a bit far.

If the Professor of Ian Flemingology at Cambridge University said that Craig was an awful Bond lots of people on CommanderBond etc would say: " have you read the books? I'VE READ THE BOOKS - CRAIG IS IAN FLEMING'S JAMES BOND".

Post by **The Sweeney** » Sun May 27, 2007 11:06 pm

Jermaine76 wrote: We only speak the truth. Unless you can direct me to a place where pro-Craiggers has stated specifics on why they believe Craig is Fleming's Bond, I'll stand by my statement.

I'll stand by my statement, and the pro Craigers just speak the truth too.

Just go and read any of the CR reviews on MI6, AJB, CBn, and I'm sure after a short while you'll start to find specific opinions on why Craig is Fleming's Bond. If you want me to throw in a couple for good measure, here goes -

Killer, ice-cold, blue eyes (exactly as I imagined from the novels)

A face that looks cruel, sadistic (in TSWLM, the heroine thinks Bond is one of the bad guys on first sight of him, and in FRWL, SMERSH sum up his photograph by thinking he looks a nasty piece of work)

Muscular, toned body that looks like he could kill a man with his bare hands (as Bond often did in the books)

And as for certain scenes in CR - the drink scene in the bathroom, Bond reflecting, staring himself in the mirror, covered in blood. This is Fleming's Bond.

Bond lying battered and bloodied in the Aston Martin, Bond looking scared before the torture, Bond screaming out in pain at the torture, and Bond recovering in hospital after the torture, these are all examples of Fleming's Bond, and never before been captured like this on screen until now.

As for the anti-Craiger's, it's just the same points churned over again and again and again. Too short, blonde, ugly, unrefined...er...that's it!