The BJMDDS General Discussion Thread......

[The Sweeney]

What makes Haggis the sudden end all for Bond scripts anyway? Eon did just fine without him.

I have to disagree there, bj.

IMO, the Brosnan films suffered most due to bad scripts. I think EON desperately needed another writer.

Are you saying Haggis' rewrite is such a breath of fresh air Sweeney? Were rewrites done prior to CR? He was paid $4 million to rewrite P&W's ideas for The Bourne Mimicry in 2008. Why?

I'm not sure of P&W's involvement with CR or Bond 22, or Haggis's involvement with either, but for me CR as a script worked (thanks to it being adapted from a Fleming novel in the first place).

Whereas the weakest link in the Brosnan films was the script.

[bjmdds]

What makes Haggis the sudden end all for Bond scripts anyway? Eon did just fine without him.

I have to disagree there, bj.

IMO, the Brosnan films suffered most due to bad scripts. I think EON desperately needed another writer.

Are you saying Haggis' rewrite is such a breath of fresh air Sweeney? Were rewrites done prior to CR? He was paid $4 million to rewrite P&W's ideas for The Bourne Mimicry in 2008. Why?

I'm not sure of P&W's involvement with CR or Bond 22, or Haggis's involvement with either, but for me CR as a script worked (thanks to it being adapted from a Fleming novel in the first place).

Whereas the weakest link in the Brosnan films was the script.

That was Haggis doing a P&W rewrite of an original Fleming script, correct? What makes you think he can now do an original Bond action adventure script that works with Forster, of all people, as his director? I think you may be in for a huge let down Sweeney. Just look at Crash and In The Valley Of Elah. Where is the greatness there? I think both were poor and Crash was praised by Hollywood only for it's political content. These films show nothing to me about Haggis' ability to pull off an original Bond script. Why do you praise this guy so much after just ONE UNoriginal Bond treatment? You have the MGM head Sloan calling the shots and supposedly signing Craig to a 4 picture deal, you have Amy Pascal being shown the door with Sony, you have Barbara Broccoli silent in any talks about the future of the franchise, MGW seems to be an innocent bystander on all decisions, a director who has NO experience in action packed films, and a rewriter who threw out his first draft of his first rewritten original Bond script. Are the inmates running the asylum or what? My title of The Bourne Mimicry will be closer to the essence of Bond 22 than you will believe. Maybe Haggis bought TBU's DVD and did his rewrite script while watching it.

[The Sweeney]

What makes Haggis the sudden end all for Bond scripts anyway? Eon did just fine without him.

I have to disagree there, bj.

IMO, the Brosnan films suffered most due to bad scripts. I think EON desperately needed another writer.

Are you saying Haggis' rewrite is such a breath of fresh air Sweeney? Were rewrites done prior to CR? He was paid $4 million to rewrite P&W's ideas for The Bourne Mimicry in 2008. Why?

I'm not sure of P&W's involvement with CR or Bond 22, or Haggis's involvement with either, but for me CR as a script worked (thanks to it being adapted from a Fleming novel in the first place).

Whereas the weakest link in the Brosnan films was the script.

That was Haggis doing a P&W rewrite of an original Fleming script, correct? What makes you think he can now do an original Bond action adventure script that works with Forster, of all people, as his director? I think you may be in for a huge let down Sweeney. Just look at Crash and In The Valley Of Elah. Where is the greatness there? I think both were poor and Crash was praised by Hollywood only for it's political content. These films show nothing to me about Haggis' ability to pull off an original Bond script. Why do you praise this guy so much after just ONE UNoriginal Bond treatment? You have the MGM head Sloan calling the shots and supposedly signing Craig to a 4 picture deal, you have Amy Pascal being shown the door with Sony, you have Barbara Broccoli silent in any talks about the future of the franchise, MGW seems to be an innocent bystander on all decisions, a director who has NO experience in action packed films, and a rewriter who threw out his first draft of his first rewritten original Bond script. Are the inmates running the asylum or what? My title of The Bourne Mimicry will be closer to the essence of Bond 22 than you will believe. Maybe Haggis bought TBU's DVD and did his rewrite script while watching it.

Some valid points there. I guess I'm not really praising Haggis for his work on CR. I'm praising EON for having the balls to try and stick rigidly to the novel for the latter half of the film, and yes, this probably didn't involve Haggis too much.

My jury is still out on EON/Haggis/P&W too. I thought CR was a great film, and much better than anything Brosnan ever appeared in, but whether they can pull it off again for Bond 22 remains to be seen. Now that they are back to `original' scripts again, and not restricted to a Fleming novel, maybe they'll give us more of the same crap they gave Brosnan.

If they do, you will have a new anti member on here.....

[bjmdds]

I have to disagree there, bj.

IMO, the Brosnan films suffered most due to bad scripts. I think EON desperately needed another writer.

Are you saying Haggis' rewrite is such a breath of fresh air Sweeney? Were rewrites done prior to CR? He was paid $4 million to rewrite P&W's ideas for The Bourne Mimicry in 2008. Why?

I'm not sure of P&W's involvement with CR or Bond 22, or Haggis's involvement with either, but for me CR as a script worked (thanks to it being adapted from a Fleming novel in the first place).

Whereas the weakest link in the Brosnan films was the script.

That was Haggis doing a P&W rewrite of an original Fleming script, correct? What makes you think he can now do an original Bond action adventure script that works with Forster, of all people, as his director? I think you may be in for a huge let down Sweeney. Just look at Crash and In The Valley Of Elah. Where is the greatness there? I think both were poor and Crash was praised by Hollywood only for it's political content. These films show nothing to me about Haggis' ability to pull off an original Bond script. Why do you praise this guy so much after just ONE UNoriginal Bond treatment? You have the MGM head Sloan calling the shots and supposedly signing Craig to a 4 picture deal, you have Amy Pascal being shown the door with Sony, you have Barbara Broccoli silent in any talks about the future of the franchise, MGW seems to be an innocent bystander on all decisions, a director who has NO experience in action packed films, and a rewriter who threw out his first draft of his first rewritten original Bond script. Are the inmates running the asylum or what? My title of The Bourne Mimicry will be closer to the essence of Bond 22 than you will believe. Maybe Haggis bought TBU's DVD and did his rewrite script while watching it.

Some valid points there. I guess I'm not really praising Haggis for his work on CR. I'm praising EON for having the balls to try and stick rigidly to the novel for the latter half of the film, and yes, this probably didn't involve Haggis too much.

My jury is still out on EON/Haggis/P&W too. I thought CR was a great film, and much better than anything Brosnan ever appeared in, but whether they can pull it off again for Bond 22 remains to be seen. Now that they are back to `original' scripts again, and not restricted to a Fleming novel, maybe they'll give us more of the same crap they gave Brosnan.

If they do, you will have a new anti member on here.....

Can I quote you on that? November 9, 2008, the Sweenster comes over to our side? I look forward to that!

[The Sweeney]

Are you saying Haggis' rewrite is such a breath of fresh air Sweeney? Were rewrites done prior to CR? He was paid $4 million to rewrite P&W's ideas for The Bourne Mimicry in 2008. Why?

I'm not sure of P&W's involvement with CR or Bond 22, or Haggis's involvement with either, but for me CR as a script worked (thanks to it being adapted from a Fleming novel in the first place).

Whereas the weakest link in the Brosnan films was the script.

That was Haggis doing a P&W rewrite of an original Fleming script, correct? What makes you think he can now do an original Bond action adventure script that works with Forster, of all people, as his director? I think you may be in for a huge let down Sweeney. Just look at Crash and In The Valley Of Elah. Where is the greatness there? I think both were poor and Crash was praised by Hollywood only for it's political content. These films show nothing to me about Haggis' ability to pull off an original Bond script. Why do you praise this guy so much after just ONE UNoriginal Bond treatment? You have the MGM head Sloan calling the shots and supposedly signing Craig to a 4 picture deal, you have Amy Pascal being shown the door with Sony, you have Barbara Broccoli silent in any talks about the future of the franchise, MGW seems to be an innocent bystander on all decisions, a director who has NO experience in action packed films, and a rewriter who threw out his first draft of his first rewritten original Bond script. Are the inmates running the asylum or what? My title of The Bourne Mimicry will be closer to the essence of Bond 22 than you will believe. Maybe Haggis bought TBU's DVD and did his rewrite script while watching it.

Some valid points there. I guess I'm not really praising Haggis for his work on CR. I'm praising EON for having the balls to try and stick rigidly to the novel for the latter half of the film, and yes, this probably didn't involve Haggis too much.

My jury is still out on EON/Haggis/P&W too. I thought CR was a great film, and much better than anything Brosnan ever appeared in, but whether they can pull it off again for Bond 22 remains to be seen. Now that they are back to `original' scripts again, and not restricted to a Fleming novel, maybe they'll give us more of the same crap they gave Brosnan.

If they do, you will have a new anti member on here.....

Can I quote you on that? November 9, 2008, the Sweenster comes over to our side? I look forward to that!

If Bond 22 is more like TND, TWINE and DAD rather than the new direction in CR, then yes, you can quote me on that. I will be the most hostile anti fan ever, regardless of who plays Bond in the role.

You've all been warned......

[bjmdds]

It will be Craig in TBM in 2008, so if the script is not up to CR standards, The Sweeney is abandoning ship! I can just see your alter ego's posts bashing Eon on the MI6 forum, and the Jetsetter being under attack there as an anti-Eon protesting poster. You might even give Luds a shock to his system. Sweeney, I cannot wait to have our Skywalker officially welcome you to our side, which, contrary to the MI6ers belief, is not the dark side of the Bond force. Haggis will be the instrument of the Sweeney's turn.

[English Agent]

It will be Craig in TBM in 2008, so if the script is not up to CR standards, The Sweeney is abandoning ship! I can just see your alter ego's posts bashing Eon on the MI6 forum, and the Jetsetter being under attack there as an anti-Eon protesting poster. You might even give Luds a shock to his system. Sweeney, I cannot wait to have our Skywalker officially welcome you to our side, which, contrary to the MI6ers belief, is not the dark side of the Bond force. Haggis will be the instrument of the Sweeney's turn.

Blimey 'BJ' are you trying to scare the 'Sweeney'.............i hope he doesn't defect...............but i know what you guys are thinking......
Bond 22 will show if the producers and writing team have the will and
the talent to come up with a decent screenplay on their own without
being able to resort to 'Flemings' material.

As we know Bond 22 will be part 2 of the story started in CR, so i would
expect that the style and tone of the new film would be similar to CR,
otherwise the film will be very odd.

Personally i think (and hope) they will manage to succeed with the new film, otherwise they will lose the respect of millions of Bond fans who are
waiting to see the conclusion of this story.

As the 'Sweeney' has said, if the films go back to the style of TWINE and
DAD then i will also be bitterly dissapointed.............and then 'BJ' you
could perhaps give me a black helmet to put on and call me 'Darth Brain'.

BTW:-

It was the scripts that let Brosnan down in his tenure as Bond................
I remember during the filming of TND the British tabloids quoted Brosnan as saying the script for the film was 'S**t' and he had confronted the producers about the matter..............and they said it would be sorted out.
In fact sorted out, meant re-writing the script as the film was being made.

AB

[bjmdds]

GE was fine. The next two were OK, DAD was fine for the first 1/3. The female sidekicks ruined Brosnan's effect and his scripts should have been much better. Craig got the type of Bond role Brosnan yearned for. Now, Haggis' mind has created an ORIGINAL rewrite from P&W. Will this fly for $4 million Eon paid Haggis to rush through a script, twice? I will have both your helmets ready to do battle the day after The Bourne Mimcry is released in the UK. EA and The Sweeney, BOTH on the same side of the fence as the rest of us here! What a recruiting job will be done, and all thanks to Haggis. The title of Bond 22 should be announced any day or week now. Next week is 1 year since CR was released, and is 1 year from when the next film will be released. Watch for the PR machine to start their spin.

[Kristatos]

The title of Bond 22 should be announced any day or week now.

We've been saying that for aaaages, though. Anyone else nostalgic for the days of "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN IN..."?

[bjmdds]

Now they have run out of original titles and they wait until a few months before shooting to finalize the film. I truly believe Eon has NO clue what the next films will be and that is why the word IN will be omitted from the final sequence. The ending of CR might have said, "James Bond will return in The Bourne Mimicry", but that would be way too truthful and would have ruined the suspense and buildup of the new title. I agree though, it was nice to have the following film's title shown at the end.

[Kristatos]

I agree though, it was nice to have the following film's title shown at the end.

It was a good reason to sit through the end credits, though that wouldn't be necessary nowadays, as you'd probably have read the next film's title on the Internet before you even set foot in the cinema.

[bjmdds]

That is exactly what people did back then. One time though, I believe they wrote the wrong title for the following picture.

[Capt. Sir Dominic Flandry]

I used to love the James Bond Will Return caption.

I hope he does return one day.

[bjmdds]

For those here, we wait for the literal translation of it's essence, that 'JAMES BOND' WILL RETURN. I hope he returns sooner, rather than later, once Craig is dismissed;however, MGM head Sloan seems to be pointing towards a long tenure with Craig as Bond. It all depends on the box office revenue of the next film in 2008.

[bjmdds]

I used to love the James Bond Will Return caption.

I hope he does return one day.

USA network had The Bourne Identity Special Edition on last night which showed behind the scenes discussions. The producers stated that they wanted to try to do a 'character driven' spy film where the audience actually cared about the relationship between Bourne and his leading lady. Hmmm. Does this premise sound familiar? I guess Eon watched TBI's special edition version and ran with their concept. Will James Bond Return? If this keeps up, you won't recognize him.

[English Agent]

'BJ' you comment quite a lot about Bond copying Bourne...........but at the
end of the day wouldn't you prefer a 'character driven Bond film' rather
than another 'wham bam' action slapstick Bond film???

[The Sweeney]

I used to love the James Bond Will Return caption.

I hope he does return one day.

USA network had The Bourne Identity Special Edition on last night which showed behind the scenes discussions. The producers stated that they wanted to try to do a 'character driven' spy film where the audience actually cared about the relationship between Bourne and his leading lady. Hmmm. Does this premise sound familiar? I guess Eon watched TBI's special edition version and ran with their concept. Will James Bond Return? If this keeps up, you won't recognize him.

That's no different to the Fleming novels, bj.....(especially OHMSS and CR).

[bjmdds]

'BJ' you comment quite a lot about Bond copying Bourne...........but at the
end of the day wouldn't you prefer a 'character driven Bond film' rather
than another 'wham bam' action slapstick Bond film???

I mention it because it is quite evident and not needed and a rip-off of another film's basis. I do not want, nor need, a Bond with psychological problems killing his prey, where we see the somber look on his face as if to say, "Why did I just do that?" Yet,at the other extreme in CR, Bond tells Vesper, "I wouldn't be very good at it if I did not enjoy it", in regards to killing. You cannot have it both ways EA, and that is what Eon is attempting to do.

[bjmdds]

I used to love the James Bond Will Return caption.

I hope he does return one day.

USA network had The Bourne Identity Special Edition on last night which showed behind the scenes discussions. The producers stated that they wanted to try to do a 'character driven' spy film where the audience actually cared about the relationship between Bourne and his leading lady. Hmmm. Does this premise sound familiar? I guess Eon watched TBI's special edition version and ran with their concept. Will James Bond Return? If this keeps up, you won't recognize him.

That's no different to the Fleming novels, bj.....(especially OHMSS and CR).

But a HUGE difference to the cinematic Bond portrayal.

[The Sweeney]

I used to love the James Bond Will Return caption.

I hope he does return one day.

USA network had The Bourne Identity Special Edition on last night which showed behind the scenes discussions. The producers stated that they wanted to try to do a 'character driven' spy film where the audience actually cared about the relationship between Bourne and his leading lady. Hmmm. Does this premise sound familiar? I guess Eon watched TBI's special edition version and ran with their concept. Will James Bond Return? If this keeps up, you won't recognize him.

That's no different to the Fleming novels, bj.....(especially OHMSS and CR).

But a HUGE difference to the cinematic Bond portrayal.

I wouldn't say that huge. They attempted it quite heavily with Dalton, they even tried with wooden Lazenby. Hell, they even inserted character-driven moments in the OTT Brosnan films.