Skyfall = Bond is dead

A place for discussion of all Bond 23/Skyfall related news and rumors
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Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by Jim »

Skyfall = Bond is dead. It was fun while it lasted. 22 Bond movies: some worse than others; some brilliant, a couple of them awful. Quantum of Bondness was a sad swan song. But it was the last of the Bond movies. And now, with Skyfall, Bond is no more.
Just ease back now, Jim. Relaaax. Mr. Big wants to see you.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by Dr. No »

Welcome Jim! :cheers: Why do you say this Jim? Was it more Batman than Bond?
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by bjmdds »

Heston rocks Jim :!: Welcome aboard :!:
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Saint 007 »

Welcome to the forum Jim! :cheers:

A lot of people are saying that Skyfall is not all what the critics hyped it up to be. There's people that either hate it, or say that it's only okay. This is why I don't go along with the early critical hype. Some people get their expectations up so high, and then end up being disappointed. I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement. I don't know if it will be the worst Bond film, but I certainly don't think it's going to be the best as the critics were saying.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

Jim wrote:Skyfall = Bond is dead. It was fun while it lasted. 22 Bond movies: some worse than others; some brilliant, a couple of them awful. Quantum of Bondness was a sad swan song. But it was the last of the Bond movies. And now, with Skyfall, Bond is no more.
Its funny, every Bond film that has come along since CR seems to be the end for Bond, yet this clearly isn't the case.

QoS is far less like a Bond movie than Skyfall, that's for sure.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by FormerBondFan »

The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Saint 007 »

FormerBondFan wrote:
The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
No, I will just watch it on YouTube whenever someone uploads it there.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

FormerBondFan wrote:
The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
I doubt if everyone here doesn't see Skyfall, it will hurt EON's BO sales too much.

And as much as you all hate the Creggster as 007, it's definitely a film worth seeing at the cinema, IMO.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by FormerBondFan »

The Sweeney wrote:
FormerBondFan wrote:
The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
I doubt if everyone here doesn't see Skyfall, it will hurt EON's BO sales too much.

And as much as you all hate the Creggster as 007, it's definitely a film worth seeing at the cinema, IMO.
I prefer the new episodes of Star Wars thank you very much.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

FormerBondFan wrote:
The Sweeney wrote:
FormerBondFan wrote:
The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
I doubt if everyone here doesn't see Skyfall, it will hurt EON's BO sales too much.

And as much as you all hate the Creggster as 007, it's definitely a film worth seeing at the cinema, IMO.
I prefer the new episodes of Star Wars thank you very much.
And it is against the rules to see both?
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by FormerBondFan »

The Sweeney wrote:
FormerBondFan wrote:
The Sweeney wrote:
FormerBondFan wrote:
The Saint 007 wrote:I'll have to see Skyfall in order to make a proper judgement.
I hope you're not paying to see Skyfall.
I doubt if everyone here doesn't see Skyfall, it will hurt EON's BO sales too much.

And as much as you all hate the Creggster as 007, it's definitely a film worth seeing at the cinema, IMO.
I prefer the new episodes of Star Wars thank you very much.
And it is against the rules to see both?
Not to you and you fellow Pro-Craigs.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by Jim »

Hi guys! Thanks for welcomes! (& yup I agree bjmdds, that Heston dude sure did rock!)

Let me respond to a couple of the points in your replies in order.

Firstly though, here’s my IMDB review which raises a number of reasons I did not like Skyfall - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1074638/reviews-172

Dr. No, you ask why I say ‘Skyfall = Bond is dead’, and in answer I think it’s because essentially the character played by Craig was not Bond. My review above points out reasons why it isn’t Bond. They can tag a name onto their writing but it doesn’t make it Bond. If this is what they think will sell now, then Bond is dead.

The Sweeney, you suggest it clearly isn’t the case that it’s the end of Bond, but just because they churn out more movies doesn’t mean Bond is alive and well. If the content of Skyfall is supposed to pass for Bond then certainly to me it is clear that Bond is dead, regardless of how many times they recycle the substitute.

Quantum of Bondness at least reflected the merest glimmer of Bond, but Skyfall has forsaken all the distinguishing marks, kept the name and created a different character.

But hey I can live with it. It was a good run. At least I have 22 Bond movies to pick from.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

Jim wrote:Hi guys! Thanks for welcomes! (& yup I agree bjmdds, that Heston dude sure did rock!)

Let me respond to a couple of the points in your replies in order.

Firstly though, here’s my IMDB review which raises a number of reasons I did not like Skyfall - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1074638/reviews-172

Dr. No, you ask why I say ‘Skyfall = Bond is dead’, and in answer I think it’s because essentially the character played by Craig was not Bond. My review above points out reasons why it isn’t Bond. They can tag a name onto their writing but it doesn’t make it Bond. If this is what they think will sell now, then Bond is dead.

The Sweeney, you suggest it clearly isn’t the case that it’s the end of Bond, but just because they churn out more movies doesn’t mean Bond is alive and well. If the content of Skyfall is supposed to pass for Bond then certainly to me it is clear that Bond is dead, regardless of how many times they recycle the substitute.

Quantum of Bondness at least reflected the merest glimmer of Bond, but Skyfall has forsaken all the distinguishing marks, kept the name and created a different character.

But hey I can live with it. It was a good run. At least I have 22 Bond movies to pick from.
Funny how we all see things differently, but I found Skyfall to be the best film in the franchise, and the character I saw on screen was definitely Bond to me, far more than many other 007 flicks.

Then again, I'm a massive fan of the original Fleming novels - where Bond does go off and get drunk, feels depressed occasionally, makes mistakes, suffers hangovers and bouts of ill health.

So yes, in Skyfall Fleming's Bond is very much alive and well. :cheers:
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by bjmdds »

Again Sweeney, is Cr-egg handsome or not?
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

bjmdds wrote:Again Sweeney, is Cr-egg handsome or not?
Not at all, then again I didn't really imagine Fleming's Bond to be overly handsome either. Tough essence, rough looking, someone you wouldn't want to mess with, but with the same token, someone who looks cool too. To me Craig has all this in abundance. I never once really believed either Moore or Brosnan could really handle themselves in a life or death situation. I could never imagine either of them being able to handle themselves properly in a fight.

Lazenby and Connery appeared as though they were men capable of handling themselves, and Dalton put on a d**n good performance to make audiences believe he could handle himself.

But with Craig it is all natural - he really looks believable as a government spy out in the field, murdering the enemy and ruthlessly bedding women along the way. Being suave, sophisticated and GQ model handsome actually hindered Brosnan IMO from making him truly believable as a deadly killer.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by Max zorin »

I agree wholeheartedly with you Jim. In my view in Quantum, Craig had something of the Bond character but in Skyfall, that completely disappeared. Craig wasn't Bond in Skyfall, there was nothing good about Skyfall and that villain, I forget his name now was weird, he wasn't just poor like Dominic Green who was sort of likeable in his way but I ended up detesting his very appearance in the film, he looked stupid in that police outfit and he creeps me out.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Sweeney »

Max zorin wrote:I agree wholeheartedly with you Jim. In my view in Quantum, Craig had something of the Bond character but in Skyfall, that completely disappeared. Craig wasn't Bond in Skyfall, there was nothing good about Skyfall and that villain, I forget his name now was weird, he wasn't just poor like Dominic Green who was sort of likeable in his way but I ended up detesting his very appearance in the film, he looked stupid in that police outfit and he creeps me out.
The whole point of a villain is not to be likable. If you found him creepy, then job well done.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by Jim »

Hi again, The Sweeney - yeah, we can all see things differently at times. That's what makes for some entertaining discussion sometimes. And I can see what you're saying about the novels, in fact some of that is in some of the Bond movies, like Thunderball for example. But did Fleming's Bond in the novels mope about for months like a stroppy 13 year old in a huff? Fail to report for duty in the middle of an assignment? Get M killed? Allude to his homosexual encounters? Which book is all this in?

But although the books are where Bond began, let us not forget that it is the movies that have created the global legend over the last 50 years. And these have been the vehicle for a Bond of particular character. And that character is not a stroppy, selfish, self-obsessed, undisciplined, bisexual with madcap ideas that cause his superiors to be murdered.

Yes, you might like the new character in Skyfall, but Bond would dismiss him in an instant.
Just ease back now, Jim. Relaaax. Mr. Big wants to see you.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by The Saint 007 »

The Sweeney wrote:
Max zorin wrote:I agree wholeheartedly with you Jim. In my view in Quantum, Craig had something of the Bond character but in Skyfall, that completely disappeared. Craig wasn't Bond in Skyfall, there was nothing good about Skyfall and that villain, I forget his name now was weird, he wasn't just poor like Dominic Green who was sort of likeable in his way but I ended up detesting his very appearance in the film, he looked stupid in that police outfit and he creeps me out.
The whole point of a villain is not to be likable. If you found him creepy, then job well done.
There are villains that have cool characteristics which make them pretty likeable.
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Re: Skyfall = Bond is dead

Post by shaken not stirred »

Jim wrote:Hi again, The Sweeney - yeah, we can all see things differently at times. That's what makes for some entertaining discussion sometimes. And I can see what you're saying about the novels, in fact some of that is in some of the Bond movies, like Thunderball for example. But did Fleming's Bond in the novels mope about for months like a stroppy 13 year old in a huff? Fail to report for duty in the middle of an assignment? Get M killed? Allude to his homosexual encounters? Which book is all this in?

But although the books are where Bond began, let us not forget that it is the movies that have created the global legend over the last 50 years. And these have been the vehicle for a Bond of particular character. And that character is not a stroppy, selfish, self-obsessed, undisciplined, bisexual with madcap ideas that cause his superiors to be murdered.

Yes, you might like the new character in Skyfall, but Bond would dismiss him in an instant.
Welcome to the forum Jim :cheers:

Agreed bond now is pretty much like how doctor who was when Russell T Davies got ahold of his character and really destroyed him for a longtime (thank god Moffat brought back some alien elements of the doctor and threw out most of his human side crap and the rest), doc who went from a quirky time travelling alien to a pimp who could have any woman he wanted and did..and that's not doctor who, we don't want to relate to him, we want to go on adventures with him, just like james bond.

I really don't understand how this can be the best bond film ever and it's cool that you like the film sweeney and no one's gonna say you should or shouldn't like it but bond to Me died way back in 2005, had this been a different universe bond I woulnd't be too upset about it but this is now who the character is and even if the film does do great, the quality doesn't speak the same to Me anymore, it's all down the drain, it's all style and no substance and all craigs bond films feel more like politics and less about being the spy we all used to know and love, when you strip bond of his characterisics, remove his wit, suave, gadgets, insane villains, great bond women, are you really left with james bond or a broken man trying to be james bond but just can't do it?.

FBF: I have a bad feeling this film will get a lot of profit, knowing that My d**n country sadly went gagga over this rubbish it's gonna be the same elsewhere, still the hobbit's all I'm looking forward to now this year.
Bond....James bond....Rest in peace (1964-2002)
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